Author Topic: cacophonies of harmonius awesomeness.  (Read 4725 times)

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Offline Trapezium Artist

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Re: cacophonies of harmonius awesomeness.
« Reply #15 on: November 29, 2009, 11:38:16 AM »
Quote from: "Jem"
Studio trickery t'was ever thus. I blame The Beatles.  :lol:

Autotune gets such a lot of bad press. It's no more dangerous than a vocoder. And the world LOVES a vocoder! :D

Don't get me wrong, Jem: I'm not against the end results of studio trickery (how could I be, considering the range of stuff that adorns my CD shelves?), but somehow I feel a little queasy about finding out how it's been done. Bit like foie gras  :shock:

Perhaps because I have a serious classical / operatic bent, I also feel much more psychically comfortable about bands that can actually (really) play their stuff live, regardless of how much malarkey there was in the studio. In this regard Frost* are up there with the Berlin Philharmonic  :D

Then again, Talk Talk never felt able to play their brilliant last albums, Spirit of Eden and Laughing Stock, live, and it doesn't stop me revering them. I suppose I'm a very confused bunny ...  :?

Offline Bert

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Re: cacophonies of harmonius awesomeness.
« Reply #16 on: November 29, 2009, 12:58:59 PM »
Mmmm, interesting thread.

When I were a lad, I wanted to be a recording engineer and producer. I could never find out how to get into it (such was the state of Secondary Modern careers guidance in rural Norfolk at the time) and I never had the confidence in my musical ability (restricted to playing in a brass band with parents who would never let me have a guitar and who listened to approx nothing) to really follow my dream. Thus I ended up working in Financial Services and managing projects for a living. But, even though I'm old and warty and have kids and a mortgage so can't even think about giving it all up, if I had the chance, right now, I'd there like a shot, absorbing all this stuff and learning how to do it.

Thus, I remain fascinated at the inner workings of music production, and it never spoils my enjoyment of the music. In fact, for me, I often find I listen to the production as much as the music and I wonder, how did they do that ?  

I reckon, there's as much "art" involved in creating the sounds and the textures as much as playing the notes and on that basis, my enjoyment is enhanced with knowing how it's all done.

I also like looking at the extras on DVD's to see how films are made, for the same reason

Which probably makes me a real saddo  :)
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Offline Drarok

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Re: cacophonies of harmonius awesomeness.
« Reply #17 on: November 29, 2009, 01:02:32 PM »
I love knowing so much inner workings of these tracks, and I've even managed to use some knowledge gained from Jem on my own tracks.

For the life of me, though, I can't get the hang of mixing tracks so all the instruments come through clearly. There's some dark voodoo involved in that, I'm sure. Heavy-handed EQing without making it sound terrible, putting little pinches in the EQ to allow some sound through the bass guitar, all sorts of magic!

Doesn't stop me trying though! :mrgreen:

Offline DueyC

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Re: cacophonies of harmonius awesomeness.
« Reply #18 on: November 29, 2009, 01:51:04 PM »
My last boyfriend was (and still is...) a singer, and on the occasions I went into the studio when he was recording, I was always more interested in what the engineer was doing.

But then I am a card-carrying geek  :P

Offline sawtooth

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Re: cacophonies of harmonius awesomeness.
« Reply #19 on: November 30, 2009, 04:25:27 PM »
Quote from: "Drarok"
I love knowing so much inner workings of these tracks, and I've even managed to use some knowledge gained from Jem on my own tracks.

I couldn't agree more Drarok!
Just because we know how something has been done, doesn't mean we'll necessarily replicate it exactly, note for note, setting for setting. But for me at least, a little insight into how Jem achieves the end result can help to give a different perspective on my own feeble attempts. I think the really neat thing about these kind of walkthroughs is hearing all the little subliminal bits of audio loveliness mixed into the final track, many of which are too subtle to be audible in their own right, but would be missed if they weren't there.

Offline Drarok

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Re: cacophonies of harmonius awesomeness.
« Reply #20 on: December 01, 2009, 01:51:15 PM »
Quote from: "sawtooth"
I think the really neat thing about these kind of walkthroughs is hearing all the little subliminal bits of audio loveliness mixed into the final track, many of which are too subtle to be audible in their own right, but would be missed if they weren't there.
Ooh, yes. I do love finding there's hidden layers in songs that I've never even noticed before. There's a backing vocal singing a different melody in one of the songs I'd never even noticed until I heard the live version where's it's much louder.
Probably also due to the fact I usually have it blasting away in the car, with my own "melody" drowning it out! :lol:

Offline EVP

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Re: cacophonies of harmonius awesomeness.
« Reply #21 on: December 01, 2009, 03:39:03 PM »
I don't even sing and this makes me want to try making my own parts.
I need to get Vocalign though!

Offline Drarok

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Re: cacophonies of harmonius awesomeness.
« Reply #22 on: December 01, 2009, 09:05:55 PM »
I looked at the prices, and I can't really justify the price for just my little messings about. :(

Offline Dave M

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Re: cacophonies of harmonius awesomeness.
« Reply #23 on: December 07, 2009, 10:41:50 AM »
Quote from: "Drarok"
I love knowing so much inner workings of these tracks, and I've even managed to use some knowledge gained from Jem on my own tracks.

For the life of me, though, I can't get the hang of mixing tracks so all the instruments come through clearly. There's some dark voodoo involved in that, I'm sure. Heavy-handed EQing without making it sound terrible, putting little pinches in the EQ to allow some sound through the bass guitar, all sorts of magic!

Doesn't stop me trying though! :mrgreen:

I'm in total agreement.

I love the little tips here and there, I've tried some where I can (I'm only using Logic Express which restricts me somehwat), but I just love recording, mixing and trying to get the best out of my limited talents as I can .. Jems top tips on harmonies will now be put to the test.
... it was like watching a peach jelly f##k a steel drum ..  :)

Bloody ell Bert, swap Wales for Norfolk in the first para and that's almost a description of yours truly. Apart from the Brass band - I just drove my dad mad by using his shed to make "Guitars", and your profession, so apart from that..  ;)  and.... I totally agree.

I mentioned on the forum a while back when EIMA first came to light the ear sucking panning effect that resides around the acoustic guitar intro and I wondered at the time how it was done. The other day I stumbled upon a free VST (yeah, chepskate as always) effect called a "Classic Auto Filter", and hidden in the presets is a thing called 'auto panning notch', which appears to do the very same thing!

http://www.kjaerhusaudio.com/classic-auto-filter.php

Sorry for the rambling post which should reside in the gear section I guess.
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Offline johninblack

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Re: cacophonies of harmonius awesomeness.
« Reply #25 on: December 09, 2009, 04:34:41 PM »
Quote from: "Brom"
Sorry for the rambling post which should reside in the gear section I guess.

I think it seems quite happy here to be honest, I wouldn't want to move it and make it unhappy. :D


Always wanted to be a recording engineer. Agree with Bert, careers advice in Norfolk was pretty shit.
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Re: cacophonies of harmonius awesomeness.
« Reply #26 on: January 03, 2010, 08:55:31 PM »
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b0OzxvClwoU
the best thing ever done with autotune...

Offline vocalnick

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Re: cacophonies of harmonius awesomeness.
« Reply #27 on: January 06, 2010, 06:43:44 AM »
Another trick from the analogue world is applying varispeed as you record. A lot of DAWs won't do it, although Reaper does (and by fortunate happenstance, that's the one I use :) )

Tweaking the speed up and/or a few cents between takes will give you a much thicker and more varied sound than simply doubling yourself. I've found a combination of this, and Jem's "sing like other people" trick can yield pretty massive sounding choirs without having to stump for the session fees :)

If you don't want to pay for vocalign (and I haven't either), you could always just use your DAW's time stretch/elastic audio equivalent and line the consonants up that way - or even just do the same thing with some nifty cut/crossfade action. Sounds like it would be laborious, but once you get going you'll probably find it doesn't actually take that long.
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